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PEACH_cm View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PEACH_cm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 7:35pm
Are you of Asian decent?
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B24 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 8:06pm
I miss Ilya
"If Bellicheat pulls that rabbit out of his a$$ with this kid at quarterback, I'll personally kiss his ring." - Sporsfreak, 09/20/16

"Jags/Vikes Super Bowl. Write it down" - Sportsfreak 01/19/18
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missionshooter View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote missionshooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 8:12pm
If I were you, I'd refer it to another advisor and split the $2000 with him. It seems like a win win. Especially since you are not even profitable at this point.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdvisorHere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 8:23pm
Originally posted by missionshooter missionshooter wrote:

If I were you, I'd refer it to another advisor and split the $2000 with him. It seems like a win win. Especially since you are not even profitable at this point.

Thank you for the advice. That's what I am considering to do too. But in order to know whether the other agent will split the commission with me fairly, I need to find out how much the other advisor will receive in commission first. That is also the reason I am asking the question about the amount of commission here. I guess that is something I should know before I agree on the amount that he/she will pay me.


Edited by AdvisorHere - Feb/05/2018 at 8:26pm
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bc2051 View Drop Down
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There’s a lot of sheisters out there and you don’t want this guy getting stuck with them, so find a product that charges him a bigger commission, so it’s worth your time. Check out some 17 yr indexed annuities from Aviva or Allianz
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdvisorHere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 8:54pm
I know you are being sarcastic, and a lot of other posts are sarcastic too. I am wondering if it is wrong of me to try to find out the compensation in order to decide whether I should take a job or not? 

Whether I take the job or refer him to someone else, I still want him to be able to find the best product that suits his needs and objectives. But I also want myself to be compensated fairly. I am not able to see what I am doing wrong here.

I am not trying to screw this client or trying to take advantage of him. I just want to know if the compensation that I will receive is worth the time that I am going to spend in order to provide the best service for him. Again, this time of the year just happens to be the busiest time of the year for me too.


Edited by AdvisorHere - Feb/05/2018 at 8:56pm
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D.H.K. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D.H.K. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 9:13pm
Try this math:

100% of nothing = ?
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D.H.K. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D.H.K. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 9:14pm
Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

I am not trying to screw this client or trying to take advantage of him. I just want to know if the compensation that I will receive is worth the time that I am going to spend in order to provide the best service for him. Again, this time of the year just happens to be the busiest time of the year for me too.

You are not equipped nor trained to provide that "best service".  The best service you can do... is refer the whole thing elsewhere and spend your time where you have confidence and competence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote luvindy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/05/2018 at 9:33pm
Originally posted by B24 B24 wrote:

I miss Ilya

Damn you...I was gearing up for this before I clicked on page two.


8/31/12,Sportsfreak:
"If Barak wins this election, or appears to be clearly winning, we are all fucked. Market will tank big time."
Dow 13,090 S&P 1406
5/23/13 UC:Dow 20k before 20% crrectn Dow 15,322
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdvisorHere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/06/2018 at 12:03am
Originally posted by D.H.K. D.H.K. wrote:

Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

I am not trying to screw this client or trying to take advantage of him. I just want to know if the compensation that I will receive is worth the time that I am going to spend in order to provide the best service for him. Again, this time of the year just happens to be the busiest time of the year for me too.



You are not equipped nor trained to provide that "best service".  The best service you can do... is refer the whole thing elsewhere and spend your time where you have confidence and competence.


With all due respect, why would you think that I will not be equipped? If you think I will not be equipped to do the job because I am new, I think every IA was new in the profession once upon a time and everyone had taken the very first job when he was new. There is always your first job in the profession, is it right?

And it is not like I will just provide service to the client without concern about the quality of service at all. I have said in the initial post that I am considering if I should take the job because I know I will have to invest a lot of time to do the catch-up, studying on the different products and discussing with the wealth management team in my back office in order to find the best product for him. That meant I am planning to invest considerate amount of time to prepare myself before providing service to the client. So why would you think I will still not be equipped at that point?

Not trying to be confrontational. I am just curious about the reason that I am receiving some semi-hostile response here.

Thank you for your response and advice though.

Edited by AdvisorHere - Feb/06/2018 at 12:06am
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D.H.K. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D.H.K. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/06/2018 at 12:10am
You want to know the source of the semi-hostile posts?  Here it is:

Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

It was a typo.

I have not sold an annuity before.

The reason I am asking this question is that I have a client who approached me for annuity. As I have said, I have just got my insurance license and have never sold annuity before. In order to service him, I will have a lot of catch-up to do, such as doing a lot of studying in different products. And it just happens that now is the most busy period of the year to me since I am a tax accountant. Obviously, he is not going to wait until after the tax season. Therefore, I want to know the 'reward' in order to decide whether I should allocate some of my scarce time now to take his business. 

All you care about, is learning when it's convenient for you.  Now you have a "case", and you want to know if it's worthwhile to take the time to learn or not.

You admit to lacking the knowledge because you have a lot of catch-up to do.  (Is your Annuity CE requirement up to date for your license in California?  I doubt it is.)

You don't even know which product you want to recommend.

All you want to do... is make money from the sale.  

In short:  You have not earned the right to earn a commission on the sale of an annuity.  You haven't done the study and you're not motivated to learn to do it now.  You want the promise of the reward before you do the study and before you make the sale.

Your priorities are completely backwards.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RIArules Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/06/2018 at 12:17am
Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

Originally posted by D.H.K. D.H.K. wrote:

Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

I am not trying to screw this client or trying to take advantage of him. I just want to know if the compensation that I will receive is worth the time that I am going to spend in order to provide the best service for him. Again, this time of the year just happens to be the busiest time of the year for me too.



You are not equipped nor trained to provide that "best service".  The best service you can do... is refer the whole thing elsewhere and spend your time where you have confidence and competence.


With all due respect, why would you think that I will not be equipped? If you think I will not be equipped to do the job because I am new, I think every IA was new in the profession once upon a time and everyone had taken the very first job when he was new. There is always your first job in the profession, is it right?

And it is not like I will just provide service to the client without concern about the quality of service at all. I have said in the initial post that I am considering if I should take the job because I know I will have to invest a lot of time to do the catch-up, studying on the different products and discussing with the wealth management team in my back office in order to find the best product for him. That meant I am planning to invest considerate amount of time to prepare myself before providing service to the client. So why would you think I will still not be equipped at that point?

Not trying to be confrontational. I am just curious about the reason that I am receiving some semi-hostile response here.

Thank you for your response and advice though.


I am 95.25% sure you are not an accountant trained in the US (at least at a minimally accredited school). You would not ask such questions.
We may "rob you slowly," but you're not going to see that shit.

Edward Jones Newb, Circa September 2016
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Seigler View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seigler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/18/2018 at 5:00am
Good advice!
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Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

I am not a full-time advisor. I am a tax accountant and mainly provide retirement planning service to my tax clients on the side. So I am not fully involved in the financial advising industry. And that is the reason I do not really know the industry well. As for the numbers? Do you mean the account volume that I manage? Now the total assets amounts of all my clients is about 750K. I think I can make it to 1m by 1-1-2019 which is the bar set by my broker dealer firm to make it pass that date. But they will raise the bar to 2.5m by 1-1-2020 and there is no way in the world I will be able to reach that number.

Your situation is not unique.  Many Indy B/D's are shedding advisors whose main role is CPA, but has an advisory business as an extension of what they do.  Frankly, I don't blame them.  It's purely a business decision - you're not doing enough business to justify the increasing compliance costs and potential liability.

Personally, I'd suggest you either drop the advisory business altogether or look into setting up a RIA for that piece of your service model.  
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Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

Does anyone work with annuity here? I want to know the commission payout of selling a basic annuity, one that has fixed interest rate and with principal protection (either 3 years or 5 years). 

Let's say if I have a client who invests $100,000 in such a annuity, about how much commission I will be able to make? And would it be a lump sum commission or paid yearly for the duration of the annuity?

I have just got my insurance license and I have not sold an annuity before.

Thank you in advance.

Okay, reading further, now I have some more poignant advice: don't do this.  You're a CPA.  If you want to take on the label as some cheap annuity salesman, go right ahead.  I just don't know how you can earn clients' trust by giving them tax advice but you really have this underhanded motive that you want to shit-slam them into a high commissioned product like an annuity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nova02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/20/2018 at 12:18pm
Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

I know you are being sarcastic, and a lot of other posts are sarcastic too. I am wondering if it is wrong of me to try to find out the compensation in order to decide whether I should take a job or not? 



Yes, it's wrong on so many levels that you're thinking FIRST about how much money YOU can make before you decide to sell something to a client.  #FiduciaryNightmare
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D.H.K. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/20/2018 at 2:36pm
Originally posted by Nova02 Nova02 wrote:

Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

Does anyone work with annuity here? I want to know the commission payout of selling a basic annuity, one that has fixed interest rate and with principal protection (either 3 years or 5 years). 

Let's say if I have a client who invests $100,000 in such a annuity, about how much commission I will be able to make? And would it be a lump sum commission or paid yearly for the duration of the annuity?

I have just got my insurance license and I have not sold an annuity before.

Thank you in advance.

Okay, reading further, now I have some more poignant advice: don't do this.  You're a CPA.  If you want to take on the label as some cheap annuity salesman, go right ahead.  I just don't know how you can earn clients' trust by giving them tax advice but you really have this underhanded motive that you want to shit-slam them into a high commissioned product like an annuity.

Nova02,

First, I (obviously) agree with your advice to the OP.  He has no business trying to sell an annuity to anyone.

I would like your thoughts on annuities (and perhaps "cheap annuity salesman") and perhaps your disdain for "high commission product like an annuity" in this thread:  

http://www.advisorheads.com/why-all-the-hate-for-annuities_topic15325.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fitness1983 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/21/2018 at 3:50am
Ouch
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Nova02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/21/2018 at 11:23am
Originally posted by D.H.K. D.H.K. wrote:

Originally posted by Nova02 Nova02 wrote:

Originally posted by AdvisorHere AdvisorHere wrote:

Does anyone work with annuity here? I want to know the commission payout of selling a basic annuity, one that has fixed interest rate and with principal protection (either 3 years or 5 years). 

Let's say if I have a client who invests $100,000 in such a annuity, about how much commission I will be able to make? And would it be a lump sum commission or paid yearly for the duration of the annuity?

I have just got my insurance license and I have not sold an annuity before.

Thank you in advance.

Okay, reading further, now I have some more poignant advice: don't do this.  You're a CPA.  If you want to take on the label as some cheap annuity salesman, go right ahead.  I just don't know how you can earn clients' trust by giving them tax advice but you really have this underhanded motive that you want to shit-slam them into a high commissioned product like an annuity.

Nova02,

First, I (obviously) agree with your advice to the OP.  He has no business trying to sell an annuity to anyone.

I would like your thoughts on annuities (and perhaps "cheap annuity salesman") and perhaps your disdain for "high commission product like an annuity" in this thread:  

http://www.advisorheads.com/why-all-the-hate-for-annuities_topic15325.html

DHK - happy to comment, and please don't mistake this as disdain for annuities in general.  Obviously, they have their place and make sense for many people.  My comment was more directed at the reason these products gets such a bad name in the first place... namely, people using them as a one-sized fits all strategy simply because they have "convinced" themselves and the client that this is the best solution.  Really, it's because of the commission they're receiving.  That being said, I've used them with clients and while there's nothing wrong with earning a commission if it's appropriate, I often wonder whether these products would still be used if there was NO commission involved.  Simply put: is the annuity still the "right" product if you didn't receive a commission?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote helado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb/22/2018 at 12:58am
Commission on a 5 year fixed annuity is typically in the 2-3% range with no trail. It’s all up front. I would recommend you look at:

Security Benefit Advanced Choice

3 year rate is 2.0% (commission is 2%)

5 year rate is 2.8% (commission is 3%)

Pacific Life Expeditions w/ rate advantage feature. The contract has a guaranteed rate for the surrender period like every other MYGA, but allows you to increase the rate one time throughout the surrender period to whatever the future rate is on new products (so if rates go up you can get the new rate for the rest of your term).

They have a 5 year and a 7 year. I think the 5 year is around 2.0% guaranteed. The 7 year is around 2.5% guaranteed. These are estimated rates.

Pacific Life has a trail option that is .40% per year on the 5 year, and .50% per year on the 7 year (no commission up front on either).

Security Benefit also has a cool MYGA called Rate Track. They have a 5 and 7 year version. There is a guaranteed rate of something like 1.4% and 1.6%, but each year the rate is the guaranteed base rate plus 90 day LIBOR. Happens each year automatically (and the base rate cannot change). I think commission on this is 3% (no trail).

For smaller accounts where you might want a flexible premium (monthly DCA, or annual IRA contributions), you might want to look at:

Security Benefit Total Interest. 6 year surrender. First year rate is 3.5%. Years 2-6 are targeted at 1.5%. It offers a non-rolling surrender schedule of 10 years. And you can add a return of premium guarantee for .10% per year. Commission is 5% w/o a trail, or 4% with a .15% trail.

Jackson Max One XL. Another 6 year flexible premium. First year rate is currently 3.6% (over $100K is 3.9%). Years 2-6 are targeted at 1.6 (or 1.9%). Has an MVA. Allows 10% free each year from day 1. Commission is 3% up front w/o a trail, or 1.5% up front with a .30% trail, or nothing up front with an immediate 50 bps trail.

You can get contracted with all of these companies and products directly. You don’t need an IMO/FMO, or a b/d.

All three companies also offer FIAs if you are interested in those products (PAC Life guarantees their caps for the whole surrender period, which is unique, Jackson usually has solid rates, and Security Benefit has a strong GMWB rider for deferred income, if that’s your thing).

Don’t quote me down to the bps on the rates, but they are close. Hope that helps.

My posts are for abrasive entertainment only. Nothing posted is investment, legal, tax or any type of advice, nor is anything mentioned true or even based on real events. Posts are complete fiction.
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