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Considering Industry |
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FUTURE#ONE 
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Joined: Jan/06/2011 Status: Offline Points: 1 |
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 Topic: Considering IndustryPosted: Jan/08/2011 at 2:01am |
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Hello All I am in the hiring process at EDJ and ML. Want to get unbiased info on the business and the companies I'm considering also tips on getting hired. I have nearly a decade of sales experience and feel like the career is right for me!!! Thanks!!
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Wet_Blanket
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Team America (not iMo) Joined: Mar/10/2010 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 46822 |
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Posted: Jan/08/2011 at 7:39am |
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Welcome to the board. We have members from both firms here so hopefully your questions get answered.
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Stealthadv
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Joined: Jan/05/2011 Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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Posted: Jan/09/2011 at 4:00pm |
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I would go with EDJ if you are up to the challenge. You'll likely keep your job longer if you have a tough time. If you are really confident, ML could be better if you feel like you need that level of sophistication to build the type of business you want.
At EDJ you can have and get paid on regular clients at Merrill they really only want the larger ones. At some point though, if you are successful, you'll realize you don't need either one and you'll try to figure out how to go independent. |
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Chas70
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Joined: Aug/11/2010 Status: Offline Points: 15 |
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Posted: Feb/12/2011 at 7:28pm |
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So true |
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Chas70
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Posted: Feb/12/2011 at 7:29pm |
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So true.
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jason7613
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Posted: Feb/14/2011 at 6:53pm |
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I'm new to the adviser role but not to banking. My advice is the same as above. Go with EDJ to start off with as I hear ML is good for an existing book. Good luck.
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Posted: Feb/14/2011 at 7:06pm |
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I'd probably go the other way around to be honest (unless you eventually want to be at ML for sure).
ML will pay you WAY more of a salary in your first 3 years. Plus, if you fail out of ML (which you probably will), you can still get a job ANYWHERE in the industry. The hurdles are so high, there is no shame in failing there; you almost need a little bit of luck to survive. You can always go to EDJ after failing out. But if you go to EDJ to start, you get a salary for 1 year (maybe 18 months), and it's about $12 an hour. You have no office. And, if you fail out, a wirehouse is unlikely to take you because the hurdles are so much lower at EDJ, there is no reason to believe you'd have a snowball's chance at a wire. The only exception to this, in my opinion, would be if EDJ was going to offer you an existing office or a Goodknight program. Good luck either way. |
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Sportsfreak
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Wise Old Perv and CTO of AH Joined: Mar/09/2010 Status: Offline Points: 25709 |
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Posted: Feb/14/2011 at 7:22pm |
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I am not familiar with the EJ training program other than what i read here, but i highly doubt it can come close to the ML program. Their program is considered tops in the industry. Ice is right, most do fall out, but thats because they set the bar high to match the level of training.
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If you eat an entire cake without cutting it, then technically, you only had one piece
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NYCTrader
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Posted: Feb/14/2011 at 7:55pm |
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Will ML put you on a team or allow you to build your own practice? Problem with the wires these days is they are all about teams and complexes, not individual practitioners. One plus of Jones is they allow you to run your own business. If your end goal is to have your own independent practice, Jones might be the best way to get there in the current environment (full disclosure, I started at UBS and am now an Indy RIA). |
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"We don't play games with overpriced assets" -- Jeremy Grantham, GMO
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 7:35am |
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Go ML. Jones may put you in an office, but you need to observe other people working for the first few years. You don't get that at Jones.
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Ron 14
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 8:58am |
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That is a tough one on where to start, Jones or ML. These guys are probably right. You get fired from ML you can always go to Jones and not the other way around. If I started at ML I probably would have left the industry altogether had I been fired. I can only imagine that level of douchebag roaming the floors of the ML office in downtown Chicago. I would have been fired for throwing a punch before production even mattered.
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moneyguy
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Joined: Mar/15/2010 Status: Offline Points: 1668 |
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 9:16am |
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A few comments:
While ML has this reputation of having the best training program on the street, I have no idea how they got it. Unless the rest of the world sucks that bad at training, it is hard to fathom. There really is no "training" to speak of. It is all self-paced Internet based training. Now they have some weekly calls, but I don't think that provides much help either. Now, they do pay better than most, if not all. If that is what gets them high marks for "training", then I can see it. I was paid 70k for about two years, plus bonuses. My view of their training program is not meant to be harsh, I think most programs out there puts the onus on the newbie to figure things out on their own, and I don't blame them, with the failure rate as high as it is.
You are not forced to join a team by any means. If you are invited to join a team, you should consider yourself lucky, as it is a much easier path. That is, if the team itself doesn't chew you up and spit you out, which is also a significant possibility. You will generally have to prove yourself prior to having any opportunities like that.
I'd start at ML for the salary alone, it makes the transition from a "real job" a hell of a lot easier.
To disclose, my experiences overall at ML were very positive. Besides getting screwed over internally a couple of times, the management was good, compliance was fair, and the other advisors were largely helpful when approached. But in the end, I figured I could make a hell of a lot more money on my own (and I was right).
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RIArules
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 10:11am |
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My EDJ field trainer spent 5 years at ML. He told me the training program consisted of handing him a phone book. Then again, he was somewhat full of the kool aid.
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“We are all Antifa” - Hacksaw 9/12/2025
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Ron 14
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 10:30am |
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moneyguy how far removed are you from the ML training?
What are the goals there? I was under the impression that if you don't bring in 500k a month in new assets it is pink slip time. |
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moneyguy
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 10:45am |
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My can sell was late 07. Was still considered in training until 09, "graduated" in the beginning of 09. Left in the middle of 10.
I can't recall with certainty what my interim goals were, but I needed 15mil (of which 10mil had to be "annuitized") to graduate, and 18-24 months to do so depending on salary. Since my salary was on the high end, I had 18 months. At the end of 18 months, you weren't necessarily fired if you didn't have the requisite assets, but your salary went away. Attrittion followed.
With that said, there is a new iteration of the training program with multiple requirements being production, net new households (250k+), and assets. Assets seems the easiest of the goals. Again, the numbers vary by level of salary, but I believe the least restrictive asset measure was a measly 8mil in 3 years. But production requirements are high (275k I think, maybe over 2 years?). I didn't really have production requirements per se, so I was able to build a nice fee-based business (great for portability, thanks ML!) It seems these days, ML is essentially forcing newbies hands to do more transactional business to hit the relatively lofty production requirements. My guess is that there are a lot of variable annuities being sold with upfront commission. That upfront commission (4.5% max) goes nearly directly to ML, other than some small bonus payouts. This helps ML offset the cost of their training program, by making them focus on production, whereas the predecessor program focused on assets. So by the time this new crop of FAs "graduate", they could easily be left with a very low ROA book. Works pretty well for ML, but not great for the newbie.
Sorry for the ramble.
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Ron 14
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 10:47am |
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No that is good stuff. 15mil in 18 months? Wow. Do they just hand you the phonebook or they just tell you they don't care how, just do it?
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noggin
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Joined: Mar/11/2010 Location: Parts Unknown Status: Offline Points: 2477 |
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 10:47am |
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I would expand the number of firms considered....ML and EDJ are so different. I was at EDJ for 6 years before going independent. After 3 years at EDJ, I was offered by ML but I didn't like the offer and the environment. After you get used to having your own office, working in a bullpen is not that attractive. They each have their positives and negatives but I would definitely consider other firms as well. Good luck!
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What keeps us captive are our own fears.- Moraen
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NYCTrader
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 12:08pm |
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Prior to leaving UBS, the firm was forcing all trainee advisers who weren't putting up numbers to join a team. I know of 7 FAs that joined teams. 1 of them is still in the biz and he is pretty miserable -- feels like he is getting a raw deal in terms of comp. All 7 thought they were joining great situations. I would be very careful about entering the biz as a junior adviser on a team. Sure, there will be a lot to learn from the senior advisers, but the business you originate will be property of the team. And you will sell your prospects on the benefits of becoming a client of the team. If things ever go south or if you decide you want to go Indy on your own, those clients will not be portable. You will essentially be a hired gun for the duration of your stay at ML if you're placed on a team. If a team environment sounds fine to you in long term, then it could be a good fit. But if your goal is to build your own Indy practice, your time spent on a team will be a learning experience, but not necessarily a business building experience. |
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"We don't play games with overpriced assets" -- Jeremy Grantham, GMO
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moneyguy
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 12:14pm |
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I'm sure it varies by office, but in mine, as long as you were bringing in assets, they left you alone. If you weren't, they wanted you cold calling and turning in activity reports. They would also support us with the postage cost of mailers, if one was so inclined. I took advantage of that to do a decent seminar campagin. Tried cold calling for about five minutes and realized...oh shit, I can't do this.
They did their best to provide coaching, but in the end, this is a self-motivated business. There is only so much a coach or mentor can do to help you on your path to success. I think you either have it, or don't ("it" being either skill, work ethic, luck or a combination), and no coaching or training was going to change anything for me.
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moneyguy
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Posted: Feb/15/2011 at 12:17pm |
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FUTURE#ONE wrote: